
Podcast by Frank Simonds & Tori Harper
Podcast by Frank Simonds & Tori Harper
02 June 2025
Show notes Ep 6 - Bereavement
Scarlett’s Story
Never had a hitch in work until March 2023 when my step-dad (who I call my dad) passed away suddenly.
This came as a massive shock to the whole family. And I had seen him just the day before as he was putting shelves up in my flat.
This came as a massive blow to me as he came into our lives at a time when we really needed him and he stepped him and became the greatest father I could ever ask for.
Immediately the day after I was due to be in work and begin a set of 6.
The day he died police attended along with ambulance and my mum naturally panicked not knowing weather I was on shift and was going to find out the news via someone other than family- the officers there reassured here that wouldn’t happened and said they’d inform my Sargeant.
However this did not happen, but I completely understand that with a million things on their plate - things slip and unfortunately my Sargeant was not informed and I had to text and explain why I wasn’t in the next day.
However she was fantastic along with my supervisor.
I took the set off. And I felt really in two minds about what to do next. This was a massive loss for me and I really felt the grief weigh heavy and I knew I needed time to sit with it and be with my mum who needed family more than ever.
However I also felt a huge amount of guilt when thinking about being off work - and I feel now that’s because of the nature of the job. Yes, my role is replaceable and the work can be disturbed among others but I felt like I had to be at work otherwise people would have thought I was taking the mick - which I know wouldn’t have been the case at all. I almost felt an obligation to be at work.
And for that reason I returned the set after. I remember going in plain clothes and sitting at the desk just staring and trying not to cry when people spoke to me. In no way was my mental health in any place to return to work. I just felt like I had to. Even though there was no pressure from anyone for me to do so.
My Sargeant and my supervisor asked me if I was sure I wanted to return and provided me with lots of support.
Other colleagues asked me what I was even doing back, and I remember a close colleague of mine saying “it’s just a job”.
Which yes it is - I just didn’t feel that way at the time. I felt intense guilt about not showing up. So I prioritised that over my mental health.
I ended up having days off sporadically but I just felt destroyed underneath but managed to brave face it into work.
I ended up being in a lot of denial because I didn’t have time to grieve and got prescribed anti-depressants which made me feel like a robot.
It was only months and months after his death that I came off anti-depressants that I realised how much I should have taken the break and not returned to work so early.
My biggest lesson was to take the time off work! I regret not taking that time off to go away and grieve and my advice to anyone else in that position would be for god sake take the time off that’s offered to you. Don’t try and force your way through.
My team and supervisors were so supportive so I take my hats off to them - there were days when I was told to go home - with much resistance on my part but did me the world of good.
Three aspects of bereavement - Emotional (will affect everyone); Some may also have to deal with the Organisational (funeral / celebration of life); and Administrative (informing companies and dealing with estate).
Emotional
In 1969, Dr. Elisabeth Kübler-Ross introduced the “5 Stages of Death,” also known as the “5 Stages of Grief®,” the “5 Stages of Loss®,” or simply “The 5 Stages.” These stages—Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, and Acceptance—reflect common emotional responses to change, loss, or shock. While they are often depicted in a linear sequence for clarity, Kübler-Ross emphasized in her 1974 book, “Questions and Answers on Death & Dying,” that these stages are not necessarily experienced in a fixed order. She also noted that these stages are applicable to various forms of grief, change, and loss. Additionally, her work explored other emotional responses, including partial denial, anticipatory grief, shock, hope, guilt, and anxiety. Since the publication of “On Death & Dying,” these stages have been further developed into the “Kübler-Ross Change Curve®,” with several illustrations available on our web page. Since the 1980s, the Kübler-Ross Change Curve has become a cornerstone of change management.
The stages of the Kübler-Ross Change Curve are not experienced in a strict sequence, nor do they always progress in a linear fashion. The emotional journey can be cyclical, with stages overlapping or repeating in response to evolving aspects of the change. This non-linear progression reflects the complexity of emotional responses, highlighting that the path to acceptance and adaptation is often a dynamic and iterative process.
Individuals may find themselves revisiting stages multiple times as they navigate through change. For example, many experience shock, characterized by disbelief and numbness as they confront change. It is not unusual to utter comments like “This can’t be happening, what now?” This experience can be disorienting, leaving them feeling paralyzed or struggling to fully understand the implications of the shift.
Overall, the Kubler-Ross Change Curve provides a framework for understanding the emotional progression through change. It highlights that while the process can be complex and cyclical, each stage is part of the ongoing journey toward acceptance and adaptation.
Pre-Death
If you have a loved one with a terminal medical condition, the grieving process may start before they die. Many organisations (such as hospices) offer pre-death counselling to help you emotionally deal with your expected bereavement.
Help
Cruse Helpline: 0808 808 1677.
Leave from work:
Police -
Parental Bereavement Leave: https://www.polfed.org/media/17720/annex-t-and-ta-guide.pdf
If not, you may be allowed to use annual leave.
Organisational
Benefits:
Bereavement Payment Support - https://www.gov.uk/bereavement-support-payment
Funeral Expenses Payment - https://www.gov.uk/funeral-payments
TOP TIPS:
Get multiple copies of the death certificate (at least 5 recommended) to aid informing companies.
Have a trusted friend / family member accompany you to appiontments like registering the death; visiting the funeral director; meeting with the celebrant. Ask them to take notes as with all the emotion, you may forget what is said.
After the important meetings, decompress by going out for coffee and cake, or lunch. Treat yourself.
There’s a lot to organise and not much time to do it. Days will be long, so if you have takeaways or eat out for a few days in a row, this is fine and understandable.
Friends and Family:
People will say “If there’s anything I can do….” take advantage of this and if you feel able, distribute jobs to them. This will take some pressure off of you, and make them feel like they’re doing something helpful.
Possible jobs could include:
- Company at appointments (Registrar; Funeral Director).
- Supply meals or shopping immediately after.
- Child / Pet care.
- A chat.
- Spreading the word (calling friends and relatives on your behalf; social media).
- Help planning or organising the funeral.
Or ask them what they can do to help (utilise their skills and abilities).
Administrative
Helping others by helping yourself:
Making a Will: Nowadays all estates no matter how small go through probate. A Will makes the process much simpler for your loved ones who will be left to deal.
If you have a simple estate, some charities provide FREE Will writing services that may be appropriate. For larger or more complex estates, it maybe more appropriate to employ a solicitor to help. This will cost but is money well spent.
Planning your Funeral / Celebration of Life: Write down your wishes. Burial or Cremation? Church or just Cremitorium? What music do you want played? Do you want everyone to wear black, or colours? Who leads the ceremony? Who do you want to speak / give the eulogy? Where do you want the wake to be held?
The more detail you can provide your loved ones, the more burden you will relieve them of.
Creating an admin file:
Who to inform?
Organisations may include: Bank / Building Society; Utility Providers; Mobile Provider; Mortgage Provider; Life / Buildings / Contents / Vehicle Insurance; Council Tax; Vehicle Finance / Credit Cards / Catalogues / Store Cards; Stocks and Shares.
Most large companies have a bereavement team of specially trained advisors who will guide you through the process and will be sympathic to your situation. They will need an original copy of the death certificate and you may need to send it by post.
It’s worth informing all companies as some services (such as insurances) can be invalidated if you don’t, and it will prevent post arriving in the future with your loved ones name on. You also may be eligible for a reduction or rebate in your bills.
If your loved one had debt. Don’t panic. Providers may write off remaining debt once proof of death is confirmed. If not, contact your local Citizens Advice Bureau.
Useful Websites
A step by step guide to the admin required to register a death and beyond: https://www.gov.uk/when-someone-dies
Winston’s Wish - Advice and resources for supporting children through bereavement: https://winstonswish.org/
National Bereavement Service - Advice, and signposting to resources connected with the emotional and practical aspects of bereavement: https://thenbs.org/
Cruse Bereavement Support - The UK’s largest bereavement support organisation: https://www.cruse.org.uk/
Citizens Advice Bureau - https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/
00:00
43:00
14 May 2025
Pre-Show Notes ep. 5
Maintaining a healthy work / life balance - It’s tempting to stay on at work to please your supervisor, and the extra pay from overtime is always welcome, but how does the extra time at work affect our home life, and overall well being?
The Work Life Balance Report 2024 ranked the UK 34 out of 40 countries for best work life balance with the highest rated being Spain.
https://www.theaccessgroup.com/en-gb/blog/hcm-work-life-balance-report-2024/
The European Working Time Directive (EWTD) controls the amount of time people spend at work (48 hours per week), and the amount of time spent between work (11 hours minimum).
Anyone can opt out of the EWTD and this is often considered necessary for those in blue light and clinical NHS.
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17:51
03 April 2025
Show notes Ep 4
Managing chronic illness at work - You want to contribute to your organisation, but you develop a chronic health condition that negatively affects your attendance. We discuss HR, problems with the Bradford Score, and other issues connected with working when ill.
Bradford Score -
* Originally designed for use as part of the overall investigation and management of absenteeism. In contrast, if used as part of a very limited approach to address absence or by setting unrealistically low trigger scores it was considered short-sighted, unlikely to be successful and could lead to staff disaffection and grievances.
* The formula does not consider certain disabilities which may result in short term absences, such as epilepsy and asthma, or serious but recoverable illnesses such as cancer.[6]
* Does not account for autoimmune diseases in which the occurrence of bouts of illness can be unpredictable.[2] The use of the Bradford Factor often provokes heated debate.[7]
* Unison argues that the Bradford Factor tends to encourage presenteeism, with workers fearing disciplinary action coming to work with transmissible illnesses and risking spreading disease to others.[8]
https://www.unison.org.uk/content/uploads/2014/09/TowebFact-Sheet-on-the-Bradford-Factor2.pdf
* There are alternative employee absence measurements such as the ‘Lost Time Rate’ and the ‘Frequency Rate’, or a consolidated approach that combines all three measurements.
* All methods can be applied with the assumption that employees are deliberately trying to take sickees or duvet days, or they can be used as a useful tool to indicate when certain employees need extra support. Ultimately, it’s all about context of application.
Managing chronic illness
To manage a chronic mental illness, you need to know as much as possible about it. Research the symptoms, causes, risk factors, and treatments so you can communicate clearly with your healthcare team and make informed decisions. Knowledge is power. Understanding your illness is the first step to getting it under your control.
It’s easy to feel all alone when living with a chronic mental illness, so building a strong support system is essential. A support system can be comprised of family, friends, and support groups, either in person or online. Having people you trust in your corner allows you to do things that might be hard to accomplish on your own. A support network can also provide accountability and encouragement when times get tough.
Because stress can worsen the symptoms of any chronic disease, it’s necessary to lower your stress levels. Spending time in nature, deep breathing, mindfulness meditation, yoga, or other forms of physical exercise are healthy ways to cope with stress.
Talk therapy and somatic therapy (body-based approaches such as yoga therapy or EMDR) can help you understand your thought patterns and behaviors. Therapy can also help you develop healthy ways of managing your symptoms. Ongoing treatment from a trained mental health provider assists individuals with chronic mental illnesses to feel a greater sense of self-efficacy. It also enhances their overall quality of life.
Medication such as antidepressants or mood stabilizers can play a useful role in managing chronic illnesses. Medication is often used in combination with talk therapy or brain stimulation therapies. Because medication affects people in different ways, it’s important to work with a mental health provider to create a treatment plan that supports your overall health. Additional support in the form of support groups, cognitive behavioral therapy, or social skills training may be necessary.
People sometimes use alcohol to cope with anxiety and depression, but excessive drinking typically makes symptoms worse. Drinking caffeine close to bedtime can disturb the sleep/wake cycle, which is also detrimental to well-being. For people with depression or bipolar disorder, a consistent sleep schedule is important to prevent depressive or manic episodes. And limiting alcohol and caffeine intake helps keep mood and energy stable.
The challenges of living with a chronic mental illness can be draining. However, it’s still important to find ways to focus on what’s working in your life. Even shifting your language from the negative (what you “can’t” do) to the affirmative (what you “can” do) can help reframe your perspective on living with a chronic condition. Expressing gratitude, celebrating your accomplishments, and surrounding yourself with optimistic people are other ways to stay positive.
It’s easy to fall into self-blame when you’re living with a chronic mental illness. Instead of comparing yourself to others and feeling inadequate, try treating yourself with acceptance. You might say, “I’m feeling lethargic today. It’s not reasonable to expect myself to go to the party when I’m this tired, and that’s okay.” The less pressure you put on yourself to be perfect, the easier it is to manage the ups and downs of your condition.
Knowing what gives your life meaning and purpose can be hugely helpful when managing a chronic mental health condition. Some people find a sense of meaning and purpose in their work. Others might find it through volunteering, religion, spirituality, family life, or an intimate relationship. Identify what enriches your life and invest your energy there.
Living with a chronic mental illness can be debilitating at times. That means it’s even more important to find ways to experience joy. Whether you enjoy the beach, dancing, or watching your favorite show, make time to do what makes you happy. Don’t wait until you feel well before treating yourself to pleasure. Doing things you enjoy increases the likelihood of feeling better.
While mental health conditions are a sensitive and personal issue – like any health problem – most people prefer honest and open enquiries over reluctance to address the issue. Shying away from the subject can perpetuate fear of stigma and increase feelings of anxiety. Often employees will not feel confident in speaking up, so a manager making the first move to open up a dialogue can be really helpful. It’s important that managers don’t make any assumptions, though.
Regular catch-ups or supervisions are an opportunity to start the conversation, which should always be in a private, confidential setting where the employee feels equal and at ease. Questions should be simple, open and non-judgemental to give the employee ample opportunity to explain the situation and their feelings in their own words. If there are specific grounds for concern, such as impaired performance, it’s important to sensitively address these at an early stage, but in all cases people should be treated in the same way as someone with a physical health condition – a good starting point is asking how they are.
Questions to ask
Questions to avoid
Managers should explore how to address any difficulties which are work-related if an employee shares concerns about their mental health. Encourage the employee to see their doctor as a first step and ensure they’re aware of any support available. This could either be from the organisation, for example a confidential employee assistance helpline, or from credible external sources.
Employers need to communicate clearly through policies on stress management and/or mental health that anyone experiencing challenges with their mental health will be supported. Employers need to signpost what help is available.
Insight Timer App - https://insighttimer.com/
How anti-depressents alter your perception of reality: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1156023835623308
00:00
39:24
12 March 2025
Show Notes Ep. 3
Spotting the signs... - How do you know if a colleague is struggling, and what do you do if they are? How best to support your colleagues.
Managers who know their staff and regularly hold one-to-ones to discuss work and wellbeing are placed to spot any signs of stress or poor mental health at an early stage. Often the key is a change in typical behaviour. Symptoms will vary, as each person’s experience of poor mental health is different, but there are some potential indicators to look out for.
Table 1 is not exhaustive, but it offers some useful pointers. However, if one or more of these signs is observed, this does not automatically mean the employee has a mental health problem – it could be a sign of another health issue or something else entirely. It’s important not to make assumptions or judgements, and to be led by the employee. Always take care to talk to the person directly.
Table 1: Indicators of poor mental health
Physical | Psychological | Behavioural |
Fatigue | Anxiety or distress | Increased smoking and drinking |
Indigestion or upset stomach | Tearfulness | Using recreational drugs |
Headaches | Feeling low | Withdrawal |
Appetite and weight changes | Mood changes | Resigned attitude |
Joint and back pain | Indecision | Irritability, anger or aggression |
Changes in sleep patterns | Loss of motivation | Over-excitement or euphoria |
Visible tension or trembling | Loss of humour | Restlessness |
Nervous, trembling speech | Increased sensitivity | Lateness, leaving early or extended lunches |
Chest or throat pain | Distraction or confusion | Working for longer hours |
Sweating | Difficulty relaxing | Intense or obsessive activity |
Constantly feeling cold | Lapses in memory | Repetitive speech or activity |
Illogical or irrational thought processes | Impaired or inconsistent performance | |
Difficulty taking information in | Uncharacteristic errors | |
Responding to experiences, sensations or people not observable by others | Increased sickness absence | |
Increased suicidal thoughts | Uncharacteristic problems with colleagues | |
Apparent over-reaction to problems | ||
Risk-taking | ||
Disruptive or anti-social behaviour |
Samaritans - 116 123 FREE
Mind - 0300 102 1234
NHS - 111 or 999
The 8 Minute Catch-up
An idea popularised by Simon Simek based on work by psychologist Dr Robert Waldinger.
Agree an 8 minute time limit at the beginning of the phonecall, or text beforehand (“Have you got 8 minutes?”). The time limit forces both parties to get down to business and be striaght with each other.
https://simonsinek.com/stories/the-incredible-power-of-an-eight-minute-catch-up-with-a-friend/
Empathy focussed calls aid Diabetes management
Using empathy in Communication
https://www.physio-pedia.com/Using_Empathy_in_Communication
Mental health conditions don’t necessarily stay the same. They can fluctuate over time. If you experience changes in mood, physical health, or behavior, you may need additional support.
Examples of these types of changes are:
These symptoms may indicate the need for a higher level of care, such as residential or outpatient treatment.
A key part of spotting the signs is managers being alert to the potential workplace triggers, such as:
External triggers may also affect an employee’s mental health and wellbeing, such as:
00:00
19:16
26 February 2025
Show Notes Episode 2 - Smells Like Team Spirit
Morale is not just an issue for the military, it can affect any group of employees. How can morale be raised within a team, and examples of when employers get it right, and wrong.
‘Gareth’s’ story (ITV - Sep 2024)
A serving firefighter has described how he believes South Wales Fire and Rescue Service has not acted on the findings of a damning review into its culture.
'Gareth', which is not his real name, told ITV Cymru Wales that "things that haven’t been dealt with and the same old things on station are still being said".
He said if issues continue at the scandal-hit service, it could pose a risk to the public's safety.
'Gareth' said when issues first came to light about bad behaviour at South Wales Fire, he was relieved that he wasn't alone in thinking there were problems.
He told us he had witnessed people making "racist jokes, racist comments about people’s skin, people’s religion, people fleeing horrendous situations."
"There was a story about someone in charge of a watch who had taken the brave step to come out as part of the LGBTQ+ community", he said.
"Then a picture of their face was put on top of a Christmas tree fairy and that was put on top of the Christmas tree. I can just imagine if you were part of that community how that made you feel and how you didn’t think you were accepted as part of South Wales Fire and Rescue Service."
'Gareth' said, "it’s not something that I thought I would have to contend with joining a public service".
When a review was announced into the culture at the service, 'Gareth' says he was hopeful that it would lead to meaningful change.
He said he was "really excited for this prospect of change. I knew a lot of people really didn’t think that anything would come of the report but I was one of those minority that thought: ‘Yes, this is going to lead to something productive and useful and help us’."
However, more than eight months later, frontline staff told us a very different story. 'Gareth' says "everything seems to have just not moved along at all." He told us he is looking for ways to leave the fire service. "Morale is really low, I don’t want to work there anymore".
"Nothing is happening, nothing is changing. The same old things on station are still being said, people are still gaining advantages because of people they know and I’m back to the point where we were a year ago, where I’m just not proud anymore."
'Gareth' wants to see change soon, but he says without accountability, things cannot improve. “There needs to be a wider conversation about how we have let things get to this stage”, he said, “and how do we go about learning from the mistakes of the past and making sure they are never repeated and no one ever has to suffer unnecessarily again”.
COVID a significant factor especially for ambulance and NHS staff.
Improving Morale
When increasing morale, small things can make a big difference.
- Important to take breaks (especially meal breaks).
- Take time to decompress after shift (ideally as a team).
- Team social activities.
If you're interested in having a team day at a Go Ape Adventure Centre, there are 37 across England, Scotland, and Wales (and no, we're not being sponsored by them, we just think they're brill)!
They also offer a 10% discount for Blue Light and NHS workers.
Have a look at their website here: https://goape.co.uk/
00:00
36:05
11 February 2025
Show Notes - Episode 1: Mental Health vs Career
Don't forget that there is an extended discussion in relation to issues raised in the episode at the Betond the Blue Light Community Facebook Group - https://www.facebook.com/groups/618892260536745
Mental Health vs. Career - When our mental health takes a dip and we need help, is it wise to tell our employer? Are we required to do so? What are the consequences if we don’t?
Tell or not?
Fire - Grey Book; Part B; General Priniciple 2 - “Where the fire and rescue authority believes that an employee’s medical condition could prevent him or her from carrying out his or her duties, the employee may be required to undergo a medical examination.”
Grey Book; Part B; General Principle 21 - Entitlement to sick pay shall be conditional on the employee fulfilling the following obligations:
(1) That notification is made immediately to the person identified for this
purpose by the fire and rescue authority.
Your employer’s responsibility to you when you develop mental ill health is primarily covered by the Equality Act 2010, unless you are a police officer when police regulations and the Equality Act apply.
Pol Fed Quick Guide to regs: https://www.polfed.org/media/19098/qrg-2023-06-12-23-v1.pdf
Fire & Rescue Services ‘Grey Book’ (6th Ed): https://www.fbu.org.uk/sites/default/files/publications/Grey%20Book%20LO-RES.updated%202009.pdf
Redmans Solicitors: Sickness at Work - A Guide for Employees:- https://redmans.co.uk/guide/sickness-at-work/
Able Futures (assistance (including grants) for reasonable adjustments if you suffer from MIH): https://able-futures.co.uk/individuals
Maximus (DWP assistance in making RA at work for those with MIH): https://atw.maximusuk.co.uk/
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39:28